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  Click here to go to the first staff post in this thread.   Thread: Remove rFmod Petition

  1. #361
    Gogobikerbis's Avatar

     PC Specification 

    Newer Member
    Jan 2012
    Location
    France
    +1

  2. #362
    Devin's Avatar

     rFactor 2 Validated PC Specification @DevinXXS 

    Registered
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Germany
    +1
    Or at least trackfiter= *

  3. #363
    Ricoo's Avatar
     

    Registered
    Jan 2012
    Funny all those +1 for individual track and mod ID.

    Guys I don't know how you can't see it won't change anything at all, it's just a different name for track ID or car ID rather than Mod ID, at the end you need the content with the right ID, and if you don't have one of those ID then you can't play.

    If a server run a track list with a track you don't have, anyway you can be refused by the server, even with a system with separate ID for tracks and cars.

    Note that with the system as it is with vMOD, it could be possible to let a player access a server running a track list he doesn't have content, provided he has the vMOD run by the server.

    And even with the system as it is now, it is possible to release a track without ID at all, same as before. The server just has to have a vMOD including this track.

    The only thing needed for the system working the same way as rF1, from user point of view, is automatic download of vMOD when joining a server.

    Cheers.

  4. #364
    thuGG's Avatar

     PC Specification 

    Registered
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Poland, Warsaw
    Obviously you don't understand what we are talking about.

  5. #365
    D.Painter's Avatar

     rFactor 2 Validated PC Specification 

    Registered
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Australia
    Note that with the system as it is with vMOD, it could be possible to let a player access a server running a track list he doesn't have content, provided he has the vMOD run by the server.
    If this were true you might have a point but not having a track install that's in a vMod means the vMod will not install. No vMod, No server entry.

    The idea behind the separate ID for tracks and cars is to allow you on a server if and when you have both currently run on a server regardless of the other tracks installed on the server. Example; You enter using the current car and track you see on the server. Server reads ID for those two components. If your installs of that track and car are the same version as the server you can enter. When the server moves on from that track just like with rF1 your all booted and then reloaded for the next track. If you have this track you enter, If not you don't and the server tales you what track you need.

    If on the other hand you try to enter a server and one of those content ID's you have installed doesn't match the server content, You don't enter but again the server can tale you what you need and one idea here is for the server to give you a link the content so you can get it quickly. You want get people to allow the content to be downloaded directly from the gaming server. This just well not work for those downloading or those that are already on the server.

  6. #366
    blakboks's Avatar

     rFactor 2 Validated PC Specification 

    Registered
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Somewhere between NYC and Montreal
    I agree with just having .rfcmp's. Since when you download an 'addon' (whether it be a single track or a whole mod, etc.) for rF2, it all gets dumped in the same spot (rFactor2\Packages). Like others have said, just associate them (.rfcmp's or .rfmod's) to the ModManager so you can double-click on it to automatically install. Once it's installed, keep a registry/manifest/database (whatever semantic you'd like to use) of all components. So, now rF2 is component-aware.

    Now, when someone starts a dedicated server: I believe I've heard other say that they can have many 'addons' on that server, but only hosting x number of cars/tracks in a session. So, since this server must communicate with the Matchmaker server, it should be easy enough to tell the matchmaker which content it's hosting. Just, instead of telling it once piece of information (the ModID it's hosting), it's telling it several pieces of information (each car and track it's hosting). I highly doubt that added bit of information is enough to cause any sort of noticeable lag in the system. Edit: Even as the matchmaking server exists right now, the car/track information is already being sent through the system.

    Now that each system is content-aware, it should be easy enough to list available servers that you can race on without having to install any new components. Are my assumptions correct? Doesn't this completely solve the whole mismatch issue?

    Because it won't be enough for people to ONLY see the servers they can currently race on, it should be pretty easy to implement options to view servers that have only certain content (i.e. maybe has a certain car you'd like to use, but has a track you don't have installed), or all servers.

    From what I've read through here, that, combined with update packages should alleviate most, if not all, issues that people who want to join a quick race and league racers may have. This makes it as easy as possible for the 'Joe Schmoe' quick racers (like myself). Plus, it doesn't create any extra work for League Admins. Since they still have to make any edits to the tracks/cars and distribute that to their members, from what it sounds like, there's nothing 'extra' involved. Unlike as things stand now. Plus, this way, if they're only making edits to a few tracks, they can release them as updates to those tracks; minimizing the size of the files they need to distribute.

    I believe that this would have been a better foundation to build off of rather than the whole ModID / virtual ModID system. Any sort of 'sessionID' or 'serverID' is just redundant. From HERE, you can start to figure out how that content is further packaged in order to make it easy to download a whole 'Mod'.

    Something that I have ALWAYS been taught in my artistic training is that sometimes, no matter how much effort and love you've put into an idea, sometimes you just have to let it go, and start from scratch again. (not that you necessarily have to start from scratch--we just need to get rid of this idea of a ModID at the moment)
    Last edited by blakboks; 02-02-12 at 11:32 PM.

  7. #367
    kleanphil's Avatar
     

    Registered
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Surfers Paradise ,Australia
    This hopefully is what we should be seeing.

    As far as i can see its an option that should be kept.

    rFMod is only the start to where this can go,still beta

    rf2 menu blank wip.jpg

    This can happen as long as were given the option to add a link ,either when constructing mod or most likely in dedicated server

    Disclaimer:This jpeg is a Beta ..it doesnt work properly yet
    Last edited by kleanphil; 02-04-12 at 08:55 AM.

  8. #368
    rer8's Avatar

     rFactor 2 Validated PC Specification 

    Registered
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Wichita, KS
    I have just spent 3 days attempting to get rF2 to work without crashing. I have made 5 complete clean installs of rF2 and the game continues to crash during the track initialization or before. It also crashes when I log into a game if I am fortunate enough to get that far. I have always believed that no complaint should be presented without a reasonable and well thought out answer to that complaint. Here's mine:

    Every time I start the rF2 game I am reminded that my computer is being interrogated by your (ISI) computer. This is fantastic. It means that it would be possible for your computer to interrogate my computer for an inventory of my content and to initiate a silent non-intrusive download/install of the current content. In this scenario, it would work something like Microsoft does with respect to the operating system on my computers. ISI content providers and players would all be fairly represented in a process like this and the player would not find himself working for days without success, and for that matter without a "map." This quid pro quo (returning of favor: the giving of something in return for something else, often in a spirit of cooperation) activity happens every day that one of an estimated 11.4 million people log on to Blizzard to play World of Warcraft. WOW, what a concept.

    What say you, ISI?

  9. #369
    Jameswesty's Avatar

     rFactor 2 Not Validated 

    Registered
    Jan 2012
    WHAT WE NEED IS FOR ISI TO HAVE A CENTRAL SERVER AND WHEN YOU JOIN A ON-LINE RACE IF YOU DON'T HAVE THE TRACK OR CAR THE GAME AUTO DOWNLOADS THAT CONTENT FOR YOU ( I originally thought this is what the 12 a year fee was for)

    It has worked like this for years with Counter strike , Unreal tournament , track mania.

    Granted the file sizes can be large in RF2 with a track coming in at over 400MB , that just means ISI have to be more innovative with the system and offer out of game downloading as well as in game auto downloading that people with fast internet can use.

    Maybe allow people to right click on a server and select download all server content in game and then have it download , but also have an out of game down-loader that will also grab content so you can DL when you are doing other stuff.

    When you try to join a server and the box comes up to tell you you don't have the content that box should also have a button on it that links to the content ( or lets you download the content in game)

    Working with the current system they could hack something in so that when you right click on a server name in the server list it could have a link the user clicks that then takes you to all the content maybe on a webpage hosted by the people that own that server. ( or instead of right click just have a download server content button where the server info is)

    ISI Don't necessarily have to host the content themselves allot of Counter strike servers host the content on there own server but using a separate system so users get a fast download of the maps without affecting the "game" server.

    Anyway until its some automatic process that "just happens" then It will always have issues and and always exclude more casual players.

    I would say an auto download system for tracks and cars when you join or want to join a server For RF2 is the most important thing after physics especially as RF2 is essentially a multilayer game supported by user/community content.

    Rf1 mod and track installing could be a pain at times but most the good mods uses an .EXE installer which actually made installing the mod easer than the current system.

    An advantage with the ID system they have now is that it would work well with the solutions I mentioned above.

    As people have said The ID system as it is now and how it is implemented only really benefits leagues and if not changed you will find that the most popular public servers will be ones that only run default content that comes with the game , not exactly helping RF2 reach a wider market , and not exactly promoting the whole USP of RFactor.
    Last edited by Jameswesty; 02-06-12 at 09:09 AM.

  10. #370
    D.Painter's Avatar

     rFactor 2 Validated PC Specification 

    Registered
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Australia
    Quote Originally Posted by Jameswesty View Post
    WHAT WE NEED IS FOR ISI TO HAVE A CENTRAL SERVER AND WHEN YOU JOIN A ON-LINE RACE IF YOU DON'T HAVE THE TRACK OR CAR THE GAME AUTO DOWNLOADS THAT CONTENT FOR YOU ( I originally thought this is what the 12 a year fee was for)
    This is just NOT going to happen! For this to be a possibility at all it would have to be community run just like rFC started. But this time we would all need to contribute to the running costs so a company like Simraceway don't take control of it and start charging for downloads.

    What we need is this hole system to be thrown over your left shoulder. The more I try to do anything at all with this game the more convinced I am it's just the biggest cock up ever designed!

    Sure we're waiting to see what becomes of the feedback we've given on the subject so far so I'm prepared to see what becomes of it, But it'll have to have some major changes!

  11. #371
    Domi's Avatar
     

    Registered
    Oct 2011
    Quote Originally Posted by Jameswesty View Post
    WHAT WE NEED IS FOR ISI TO HAVE A CENTRAL SERVER AND WHEN YOU JOIN A ON-LINE RACE IF YOU DON'T HAVE THE TRACK OR CAR THE GAME AUTO DOWNLOADS THAT CONTENT FOR YOU ( I originally thought this is what the 12 a year fee was for)
    I guess ISI can't host mods without having the license of the cars/competitions.

  12. #372
    corsa's Avatar

     rFactor 2 Validated PC Specification Where I race 

    Registered
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Lincoln, NE, USA
    Quote Originally Posted by Domi View Post
    I guess ISI can't host mods without having the license of the cars/competitions.
    Correct, there is no way ISI can host the content from a legal point of view, due to the nature of almost every mod out there... i.e. unlicensed content. ISI would be liable for the content it provides for download.

    Even linking to content that is hosted on other servers, as proposed several times in this thread, would be a very risky proposition in the current legal landscape... just look at the whole SOPA/PIPA controversy.

    I'm sure ISI has lawyers, and those lawyers have advised them on what they can/cannot and should/should not do.

  13. #373
    Slothman's Avatar

     rFactor 2 Not Validated 

    Registered
    Sep 2011
    Links are fine....if links became illegal...well consider that if you will....

    THey wont host, they have said that already before release.

  14. #374
    kleanphil's Avatar
     

    Registered
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Surfers Paradise ,Australia
    LOL woops, that took us a bit off subject.

    The point of what i said was, by doing away with rFMod is were doing away with an option that should be there.

    A mod only needs 1 track attached,which is fair enough.If mod makers do this theres no issue.All the other tracks are just components i guess.

    But if you want to talk about the links issue please post here What bout this its a lonely thread and needs some action

  15. #375
    kleanphil's Avatar
     

    Registered
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Surfers Paradise ,Australia
    The end point being....If your going to release a mod,for e.g a drag mod,why bother unless a relevent track is attached to it.
    I think this is the point.
    A mod needs atleast 1 relevent track.
    Given the right options you won't have to download extra content.

  16. #376
    michael1's Avatar

     rFactor 2 Validated PC Specification Where I race Modding Group: F1RUK 

    Location
    Liverpool port
    Well it takes time but i think its great way better than rF1 when you could cheat easy changing files or values using programs to make the server look at another Pc while you change the engine file ect you can not do it anymore.

  17. #377
    Jim Beam's Avatar

     Where I race 

    Registered
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Brisbane, Australia
    what makes you think that has changed?

  18. #378
    ZeosPantera's Avatar

     PC Specification 

    Registered
    Oct 2010
    Location
    NYC
    Just separate Cars and Tracks.. I want to drive all my cars on all my tracks.. It isn't that hard a concept to understand. Why on earth would you attach the two together like TOCA Race Driver did? I spent hours trying to get the race trucks in that game on other tracks.

    Just make it pick CAR.... TRACK.... RACE..

    Not pick MOD (Car+Track) --- MOD2 (Car+Track+newTrack) --- Upload new mod2 to someone else so we can play together.. GRRERLKJERLOSID#$)(

  19. #379
    Blaktop's Avatar

     PC Specification 

    Registered
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Australia
    +1 Zeos.......simplicity.....pick car.....track.....race. It seems that instead of in rF1 where you get to join the server without the track installed and get booted, in RF2 you don't even get to join if you don't have the track (and all the other track/mod IDs and rfMods etc etc). It still doesn't seem to get around the problem of not having everything installed......rather it has created even more stuff you have to have installed.

  20. #380
    DocJones's Avatar

     PC Specification 

    Registered
    Jan 2011
    I may be stupid, but I am really struggeling to create a virtual mod just to be able to race a certain car on a separately released (non-ISI-) track online with a few friends. Watching the packaging tutorial video and reading the packaging tutorial .pdf document I tried to create that virtual mod, but only wasted an hour now and still have no idea how to really do it. Give us back the possibility to chose a track on the server without the need to create a virtual mod every time a new track is released, please.

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